Clay-mation
“We met through this album I made with a horse’s skeleton a few years ago,” says Matthew Herbert on the beginnings of the creative union between himself and drummer, percussionist and vocalist Momoko Gill.
This potentially inauspicious start to their connection has borne great dividends since its inception with new album Clay a bold move forward. The eleven tracks bristle with irregular rhythms, sounds and experimental electronics from a pair synonymous with innovation. Matthew treats the world around him as an instrument, having previously used animals and even the sound of an exploding bomb as source material while Momoko is an eclectic solo artist who has worked with Tirzah and Alabaster DePlume as collaborators. The meeting between them was suggested by drummer Seb Rochford.
“Seb did the recordings on The Horse but he couldn’t do the live shows,” says Matthew. “So I asked him to recommend a drummer and he said I should choose Mokomo Gill because of the intuitive way she plays. And, he was right.”
Momoko stepped into the breach with the first rehearsal with Matthew taking place on the Barbican’s stage. Undaunted by the number of performers and amount of gear she was surrounded by, Momoko’s talents kicked open an exciting musical chapter for the duo.
“I really enjoy this part of collaborating with someone new,” she says. “Finding a common ground and resonance is almost the point, it’s what makes me excited and inspired by entering these creative situations.”
“It was interesting that we come from slightly different sonic worlds and we’ve been working in different ways with music. For me, this is key, finding something between us where we can connect and both feel excited to build something new.”
The record initially started life as a Herbert album but as the creative process evolved, so did the album’s arc. Clay follows the 2024 release of debut collaboration ‘Fallen’ and Momoko’s remix of Matthew Herbert’s ‘The Horse Is Here’.
“I asked Momoko to sing on what I thought would be a new Herbert record that I’d begun,” says Matthew. “Then we started writing in this fresh kind of way. It became clear that it was a joint record, then we became a band. It’s been a really fluid process, from meeting to finding ourselves at this point.”
The record was moulded into shape over a 12-month period in between a variety of commitments. Touring, film scores and live events for both all took up time in the calendar with initial ideas shared remotely.
“Making the record felt rapid but it was actually a year of work,” says Momoko. “I think release dates stretch your sense of time but it felt really quick.”
For Matthew, there’s also an element of soul-baring that goes into a collaborative project, particularly when you’re working with a slightly unfamiliar creative sparring partner.
“It’s like a dance when you start collaborating with someone, you have to try and work out how to move together and what you do and don’t like,” he says.
“It can also be very vulnerable making records, especially if there are lyrics involved. You’re representing them too, it’s a constant negotiation, and in this way, I always think making albums is like group therapy – but we handled it pretty well.”
While much of the record was made remotely, there was a period where the duo came together in the same studio. It was during this time that the songcraft took on new and different shapes.
“We had this period of being in the same space together and working it out,” says Momoko. “And a lot of the songs really found themselves in new ways. There were lots of changes, we were throwing out elements and not being afraid to move on if something didn’t sound right.”
‘Clay’ is full of highlights with Matthew’s fluid productions and Momoko’s drums and melodies interlocking beautifully on ‘Someone Like You’ and ‘Need to Run’, reminiscent of the former’s past high-points with Dani Sciliano. Rather than highlight individual moments, Matthew found the whole process to be full of surprises. This album began life as a house record before morphing into more dream-like aural pastures.
“It was slightly hard to let go of what I thought it was going to be but really liberating when I did,” he says of the creative process. “It was one of those situations where you find yourself pushing against something that feels difficult, then realising that if you just surrender and go with it, that’s what it should be.”
Matthew’s history as Herbert and under various different aliases is prolific from composing mesmerising film scores and running Accidental Records to working with artists like Roisin Murphy, The Invisible and more. There’s a huge catalogue of music for listeners to delve into – and it’s an innate restless curiosity that keeps him moving.
“I’ve made a lot of music and of course, you have experience,” he says. “But you always want to surprise yourself and your listeners, I always want to feel uncomfortable – that’s the reason I think that me and Momoko do it, to be surprised. Making music is a really magical process and I’ve never wanted to take this for granted.”
Matthew’s reputation is as a disruptive, unruly studio force. Nothing is off limits when it comes to what he can make music with and twist sounds from – this is someone who has used a pig as a sounding board. For this album, much of the music was made with a MacBook and Logic, a drum kit and a microphone. Were there other essential pieces of gear?
“Broth played a really big part in it too, having really good soups and just feeding ourselves,” he says. “It sounds flippant but nourishing oneself, it’s such a vital part of making work. The world is so fucked up, it’s such a privilege to do what we do. Just to notice what you have around you is really valuable, and what you put into your body. That is really important and was the hardware behind the making of an album.”
Of course, today’s news feeds are constantly revolving around violence and anger with social media fanning the flames of rage. Both Momoko and Matthew see Clay as offering listeners some respite, even though the pair are hyper aware of what is happening beyond the studio walls.
“We’re definitely always engaged with both our immediate surroundings and the world at large,” says Momoko. “It’s not something we shy away from but the way we respond to it is not literal or in a form of commentary. But I think the record has heartfelt honesty to it and in a way that is one of the responses – trying to find harmony in each other.”
“It’s about prioritising care, compassion and listening rather than violence and judgement,” Matthew continues. “There’s a lot to be angry about, from the climate to the conflicts – and I am angry, I don’t want to play that down – but I think one of the most powerful tools in people is the ability to show compassion to people who have grown up in different circumstances or experienced the world differently.”
“As an artist, you’re trying to create a safe sonic space where people are welcome. Orwell talked about choosing to make your work not political, that’s a political choice in itself. It’s impossible to not be in dialogue with what is happening.”
With the album’s release due imminently, there are ambitions to bring the record onto some select stages later this year. Although it will feature just Matthew and Momoko, the pair are working with technical expert Hugh Jones and his company Field Tone. This is on a bespoke piece of equipment to enable Matthew to sample everything Momoko does on stage.
“It looks simple but it’s a complicated record and show to put together,” Matthew explains. “It’s super technical, partly because we want to make the live show as a duo, something I don’t think you see this so much anymore. At the core it’ll be Ableton and live instrumentation, plus there’s this drive and curiosity to see how far we can push this.”
Momoko’s advice for creatives is practical – essentially, knowing what you want from a creative partner can help you focus when working together.
“Things are expensive in London so if you want to do something with people, you need to make the most of it,” she says. “I try to really think about the parameters within where we operate – and whatever they are, I want to fully invite the person into them.”
Matthew believes one of the most challenging aspects for producers and creatives is to let go. Computers and technology offer huge amounts of control, accuracy and precision – but the key aspect is to focus on what’s important – the music.
“Some of the best recordings of drums have only one mike,” he says. “It’s not about the technical side of things, it’s actually about the energy and vibe, this is the juicy part. If you don’t, then you will find yourself downloading software updates for the latest version of a plug-in, you need a Wi-Fi password. You’ll find the divine creative spirit has moved elsewhere.”
Letting go and accepting that a piece of music is inherently flawed is also another important part of the work of today’s production process. Otherwise, you put yourself at risk of burn out.
“You have to accept that it’s going to be flawed,” he says. “It’s a bit like having kids, you do your bit but ultimately, they have to work out the world in their own way. You can make a perfect record but that can take years – and be very painful. So you have to let go otherwise you will go mad. I don’t want to do that, I want to make another record instead.”
Jim Ottewill
Buy Clay on vinyl
Buy Clay on CD
LIVE DATES:
31/07/2025 Amsterdam, Dekmantel
01/08/2025 Brussels, Kiosk Radio x Meakusma
08/08/2025 Zurich, Lethargy Festival
23/11/2025 London, Village Underground
